Nope, never was. I always considered myself a patriotic, Democratic-leaning Witness. I always thought our national anthem was a beautiful song, and as a child I felt guilty for humming it. I always thought our country, with all of its flaws, was the greatest on earth and was glad to be born in the USA.
Olin Moyles Ghost
JoinedPosts by Olin Moyles Ghost
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47
Are You Still 'Politically Neutral'?
by leavingwt inare any of you still 'politically neutral' for biblical reasons?
just curious.. .
lwt.
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Republican Witnesses and Democrat Witnesses
by inkling init seems to me that witnesses are political in .
much the same way they are racist: i.e.
but not out loud.. i recall a conversation during a coffee break.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
In general, there are parts of the JW lifestyle/theology that fit well with the political left--the "new system" is basically a communist utopia. And there are parts that fit well with the political right--the "moral majority" type movements and social conservatism in general (anti-gay, anti-science, pro-censorship, etc.).
In practice, I've found that Witness political leanings are fairly predictable. The well-to-do small business owner JWs are the ones who watch Fox, listen to Rush Limbaugh, and bash liberals and democrats.
Almost all African-American JWs in my circle hated Bush and had a very difficult time staying neutral once Obama was nominated.
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What is the JW theology?
by Doug Mason inby "theology" i mean "the study of god (gk.
: theos).. jws keep rabbiting on ad nauseum about the trinity teaching being "irrational", "impossible to understand", etc.. i do not want this thread to be about the trinitarian doctrine.. i want to be given an explanation of what a jw believes.
i have seen so many arrows and spears thrown by jws, i want to know exactly what they are defending.. i want to see an explanation of "god" that is rational and can be understood.. doug.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
JW theology...like the theology of many other organized religions...consists of:
- "teaching commands of men as doctrines" (Matt. 15:9)
- "going beyond what is written" (1 Cor. 4:6)
- "trusting in nobles and the son of earthling man" (Psalms 146:3-4)
- "saying the due time has approached " (Luke 21:8)
and lots of other nonsense. Hope that helps.
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Selection of the JWs in 1918/1919 - how might a JW attempt to show from the Bible
by insearchoftruth ini had asked my wife, who is in the study phase with a jw sister about the selection of the jws by jc in 1918/1919 time frame and she had actually never heard of that.. the husband of this woman she is studying with has been chomping at the bit to talk to me...well my wife said she will ask him to come show me, using only the bible, how this selection was made...of course she did not clear this request with the dubman before telling me she would do this.. i am guessing he will be there when i get home from work tomorrow, she is also torturing our son with a bs now (her son from a previous marriage).. what sort of reach do you think he will try to make to show this...i am guessing he will try to show 1914 from the daniel/revelation stuff, if he does this i am going to ask him to show 607bce from a non jw source....since i believe it is 586/587 bce as a starting date......i hope to keep him on the 1918/1919 topic, and have some examples of their beliefs from that era to talk about as well.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Proving the WTS appointment in 1919 from the Bible requires some incredibly convoluted scriptural gymnastics. In addition to the points noted above, Malachi 3:1-5 comes into play. In this cryptic passage, God promises to send "his messenger" to cleanse his temple with the lye of a refiner. The WT interprets thiese verses as having two fulfillments (of course).
First (if I recall correctly), this was fulfilled when Jesus came down to earth. He judged the nation of Israel as being unclean and started his own religion--Christianity. The second fulfillment was in 1918-19, when Jesus came back, judged all the religions claiming to be Christian, and selected the WTS as his organization.
So this is how they get the parallel between Jesus' earthly ministry and his 1918-19 judgment. In the first fulfillment, it took Jesus 3.5 years from when he was anointed until he established the new Christian congregation (Pentecost 33 A.D., I think). Thus, as a holdover from Russell's parallel dispensations, the WTS assumed that Jesus would take 3.5 years from being installed as king until he started judging the other religions and picking the one he liked.
Note that I'm doing all of this from memory, so I may have gotten some details wrong. If so, feel free to point them out. But I think my comments above accurately reflect current WT teaching on the matter--at least at a high level.
Also, you asked about whether it would be wise to mention that modern Bible Student groups adhere more closely to what the WTS taught in 1918-19. I don't think it would add much to the conversation to bring this up. The JW response is that the light gets brighter and those Bible Students are stuck in the past. It would be a distraction and would likely lead off on a tangent.
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When will they realise that the bus isn't coming?
by eyeslice ini was still a kid and living at home at the time, and so that must have been well over 30 years ago, that i heard ron drage (now a senior member of the uk bethel) say "if you are waiting at the bus stop it, is better to be 10 minutes early rather than miss it".
what he was referring to of course was the then then 1975 issue; in other words armageddon has arrived yet but it just round the corner and we are a little early for it.. i don't know what brought this to my mind the other day but i got to thinking, surely if you are waiting for a bus and you get there 10 minutes early and it doesn't then turn up, how long do you wait?
10 minutes, 15 minutes, half an hour, an hour, two hours?
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Most won't realize that the bus isn't coming. I think this scripture aptly describes what you're seeing among the old-timers:
Proverbs 13:12 -- "Expectation postponed is making the heart sick"
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No One to Carry On!
by AK - Jeff ini recall the 'core' families that made up our little congregation in the 60's and 70's.
i had not thought about it, but the very vast majority of those families have left zero members carrying on the 'legacy' of the 'troof'.
here is the way it breaks down - the names have been changed to protect the innocent [or guilty].. the colsons in 1970 - dad, mom and two sons.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
I've seen this as well. For example, take the KH that I grew up in during the 1980s. Here's a synopsis of the elders with kids who are now adults:
- Elder 1 - 3 kids total, 2 DF'd living normal "worldly" lives with "worldly" spouses and kids, 1 faded and in an "immoral" relationship
- Elder 2 - 2 kids total, 1 inactive faded non-believer, not sure about the other kid
- Elder 3 - 3 kids total, 1 DF'd, 1 inactive fader, 1 still going for family/friends
- Elder 4 - 2 kids total, both still in and actually believe AFAIK
So, out of 10 children of elders, 3 or 4 are active JWs. At least one of those 3 or 4 doesn't believe it, so that leaves 3 *at most* who are truly believing Witnesses. That's a pretty lousy success rate...and remember we're talking about elders' kids, here!
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Do/did you like to read Daily Text?
by Albert Einstein ini hated it.
we actually never really did.. once, on vacations, we were with another family, they prepared food on the table for breakfast .... and then nobody could touch it for some 15 minutes, when daddy was reading daily text and asking childish questions ... family members were raising hands and answering .... we all were hungry... watching the food ... and hoping it will soon be over (i dont mean armageddon, i mean daily text...) i felt just like an idiot..... albert.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Similar to Undercover, I tried to keep a copy in my bookbag so that I wouldn't look like a slacker at the meeting for service.
I estimate that less than half of U.S. Witnesses (can't speak for the rest of the world) read the text on a regular basis. Among those in their 20s and 30s, I would say that the number is more like 25% or less. These young JWs are too busy working overtime to pay the mortgage on their new houses, buy the latest gadgets, and take vacations.
They feel like they're doing fine if they make most of the meetings and get out in service 2 or 3 Saturdays per month. Personal study, daily text, "improving their minstry," "reaching out" are not priorities for these gen-X Witnesses. At least that's my first-hand observation.
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TURN IN YOUR DAMN TIME - IT'S THE 5TH...
by tresdecu ini hate turning in time, even though it's phantom.
do you think they phase this out soon???
especially now that they spend so much time doctoring up the stats to make them look good.. anybody out there with some inside info?.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Oompa, you're such a trouble-maker! You should know better than to try using logic on these people.
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Was There a Fictional Work Helped You Realize the Truth About the (T)ruth?
by BabaYaga inthe pen really can be mightier than the sword, and even fiction often carries much weight and powerful messages.. did you read a book or watch a movie that made you think?
did an "entertaining" work plant a seed of doubt?.
the first one i can remember making a definate comparison to the witnesses in my mind was ray bradbury's martian chronicles.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Yes. The Bible.
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When the Music's Over...
by undercover incancel my subscription to the resurrection.
send my credentials to the house of detention.
i got some friends inside.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
turn out the lights...